I'm just throwing this out there - do the Packers really even have a chance this weekend against the Ravens? Even without their starting QB, this Ravens team is really scary, especially in the run game. All the Packers need to do is win one game to get in the playoffs, but that might have to wait until the final weekend against the Vikings ... and even then they may not be able to get the job done. Can you imagine how high the Vikings will be if they have a chance to knock the Packers out of the playoffs? I don't want to dampen anyone's enthusiasm, but is this team as good as everyone thinks they are? They lose games with two-score leads, they fumble onside kicks, their defensive backfield is as soft as melted butter, the defense doesn't force turnovers, and the team's QBs are suffering. Tell my why I'm wrong. I HOPE I'm wrong.
The Ravens are currently a three-point underdog against the Packers. That isn't to say that Baltimore can't win the game, but that does reflect how the market sees these two teams and the likelihood that either will have its starting QB on Saturday.
I mentioned this in one of the other answers, but this is where fan myopia comes into play. The Ravens have plenty of warts too, and that's why they're on the verge of missing the playoffs.
Very true about the injuries, cleezus1. Every team is banged up. I was looking for how others are seeing the game. I don't pay much attention to the odds. I like hearing what other people are seeing ... so thanks, Jason and cleezus1. Things are actually looking pretty good on the injury front for the Packers ... for Love and Malik. Let's hope.
I think this team is REALLY GOOD when healthy. As fans we forget how banged up they are, because they've been playing such competitive games even the ones they are losing there seems to be some turning point but its late or the scores are so low.
I don't use PFF grades for offensive line, so I don't really have a comment on that. I use PFF's charting numbers frequently in my coverage, and I think there's value in having more than one source for things where two parties can look at it differently like O-line play. However, I don't find that their grading system reflects performance here, at least not consistently.
I’m curious, will the Packers have a difficult time stopping D. Henry? The Ravens failed last week in not using him during the final minutes and he was averaging 7.1 yards a carry. If they don’t believe in our run stop defense and think our secondary is weak because our pass rush is different without M. Parsons, they may feel good about their chances to pull off the upset. I live in Ravens territory, so I hear how the pundits think the Ravens can take advantage of our tired defense and all the injuries. They believe that the Ravens will use Henry to establish the pass, and since we don’t have the same pass rush without Parsons and both of their QB can run. They are talking about their abilities (QBs), will make it difficult for our defense to get the right reads and to communicate, since they saw how they struggled last week.
Take the Packers out of the discussion for a moment. The way the NFL has best defended Derrick Henry is to put his team in a position where it can't lean on the run. That doesn't mean Henry can't still affect a game when the Ravens are playing from behind, but his usage changes.
So, can the Packers build a sizable lead? If Jordan Love returns from concussion protocol for this game, absolutely. He was estimated as a limited participant on Tuesday and will practice today, so there's at least some momentum pointing in that direction. On the other side, Lamar Jackson was an official DNP on Tuesday due to his back injury. I haven't seen whether he'll practice today, so keep an eye on that.
Until we have that information, projecting this matchup is just guessing. But there's certainly a realistic scenario where the Packers can pile up points and the Ravens can't ride Henry the way they'd prefer.
Do you think the general failures in the red zones over the last two weeks are similar to when Tucker went down, and it took time for Matt and Co. to figure things out?
It was interesting with Willis in there that the offense seemed to open up in a way similar to when Love went down last season. What can Matt learn from those two experiences to free up his offense when Love returns as QB? Will he?
Two weeks represent too small a sample to get much from. There's also some weirdness mixed in there (Josh Jacobs' fumble at the goal line). I don't think you can pull anything instructive from that.
Likewise, I don't think there's much to read into the half and change Malik Willis played this past Saturday. I chart the offense every week, and they didn't run all that much differently than they have with Jordan Love. Willis scrambled more, but that's not reflective of play design. The most notable thing was they had Love throw almost exclusively out of the gun on the opening possession, but I would imagine that had more to do with what they saw from the Bears on tape than anything else, given those early drives are "scripted."
Even without Micah Parsons and Devonte Wyatt, the Packers should be able to take advantage of the right side of the Ravens' O-line. Daniel Faalele has been one of the weaker starters for any team at his position, and getting quick pressure from the interior will matter whether Lamar Jackson or Tyler Huntley starts on Saturday.
Hey Peter and Jason, thanks for all the hard work covering the team this year!
The feeling around this team since the second half of 2023 (Jordan Love era) has been that they are able to beat anybody but they rarely piece all sides of the ball together and make costly mistakes that waste some of the potential. That being said, we're (one of ) the youngest rosters in the league. Do you think it's still just growing pains? Or is it too late in the process for that?
The Packers are still young on paper, but this isn't an inexperienced team anymore. Most of the key components have multiple playoff runs under their belts now. I don't think you can use age to hand-wave poor performance in the way you could in 2023.
That said, your description also fits the majority of the league's playoff teams. They might not be as young, but these sorts of inconsistencies aren't just a Green Bay thing. The Rams hit a speed bump early in the season (remember the Jordan Davis TD return on a blocked field goal?) and then blew a two-possession lead this past week. The Eagles have two multi-game losing streaks on their record. And so forth.
I think fans can get a little myopic with this stuff. They will take note of every mistake their favorite team commits but not ding other teams in the same way for their errors. It's just kind of how it goes.
All to say, I don't think the Packers are battling through growing pains, at least not in a manner that's different from other teams. I think their biggest problem is they aren't healthy on either side of the ball, and Micah Parsons isn't available to close games.
100% agree, I have so many friends and family who complain about the Packers and how they look or don't look, and its just because we watch every single snap, we see every take on social media. However, other teams also have their collapses, their issues etc. No team is perfect except for 1. It's difficult to win by wide margins in the NFL and its difficult to keep up that pace.
If the QBs were to switch teams healthy, Lamar in GB, Love in Balti, what team would win? And would both teams be able to represent their "new team" in the super bowl?
I'm just throwing this out there - do the Packers really even have a chance this weekend against the Ravens? Even without their starting QB, this Ravens team is really scary, especially in the run game. All the Packers need to do is win one game to get in the playoffs, but that might have to wait until the final weekend against the Vikings ... and even then they may not be able to get the job done. Can you imagine how high the Vikings will be if they have a chance to knock the Packers out of the playoffs? I don't want to dampen anyone's enthusiasm, but is this team as good as everyone thinks they are? They lose games with two-score leads, they fumble onside kicks, their defensive backfield is as soft as melted butter, the defense doesn't force turnovers, and the team's QBs are suffering. Tell my why I'm wrong. I HOPE I'm wrong.
The Ravens are currently a three-point underdog against the Packers. That isn't to say that Baltimore can't win the game, but that does reflect how the market sees these two teams and the likelihood that either will have its starting QB on Saturday.
I mentioned this in one of the other answers, but this is where fan myopia comes into play. The Ravens have plenty of warts too, and that's why they're on the verge of missing the playoffs.
Very true about the injuries, cleezus1. Every team is banged up. I was looking for how others are seeing the game. I don't pay much attention to the odds. I like hearing what other people are seeing ... so thanks, Jason and cleezus1. Things are actually looking pretty good on the injury front for the Packers ... for Love and Malik. Let's hope.
I think this team is REALLY GOOD when healthy. As fans we forget how banged up they are, because they've been playing such competitive games even the ones they are losing there seems to be some turning point but its late or the scores are so low.
I realize PFF grades may not be accurate but they rate the GBP offensive line as 28th in the league. Could you comment on that please?
I don't use PFF grades for offensive line, so I don't really have a comment on that. I use PFF's charting numbers frequently in my coverage, and I think there's value in having more than one source for things where two parties can look at it differently like O-line play. However, I don't find that their grading system reflects performance here, at least not consistently.
I’m curious, will the Packers have a difficult time stopping D. Henry? The Ravens failed last week in not using him during the final minutes and he was averaging 7.1 yards a carry. If they don’t believe in our run stop defense and think our secondary is weak because our pass rush is different without M. Parsons, they may feel good about their chances to pull off the upset. I live in Ravens territory, so I hear how the pundits think the Ravens can take advantage of our tired defense and all the injuries. They believe that the Ravens will use Henry to establish the pass, and since we don’t have the same pass rush without Parsons and both of their QB can run. They are talking about their abilities (QBs), will make it difficult for our defense to get the right reads and to communicate, since they saw how they struggled last week.
Take the Packers out of the discussion for a moment. The way the NFL has best defended Derrick Henry is to put his team in a position where it can't lean on the run. That doesn't mean Henry can't still affect a game when the Ravens are playing from behind, but his usage changes.
So, can the Packers build a sizable lead? If Jordan Love returns from concussion protocol for this game, absolutely. He was estimated as a limited participant on Tuesday and will practice today, so there's at least some momentum pointing in that direction. On the other side, Lamar Jackson was an official DNP on Tuesday due to his back injury. I haven't seen whether he'll practice today, so keep an eye on that.
Until we have that information, projecting this matchup is just guessing. But there's certainly a realistic scenario where the Packers can pile up points and the Ravens can't ride Henry the way they'd prefer.
Do you think the general failures in the red zones over the last two weeks are similar to when Tucker went down, and it took time for Matt and Co. to figure things out?
It was interesting with Willis in there that the offense seemed to open up in a way similar to when Love went down last season. What can Matt learn from those two experiences to free up his offense when Love returns as QB? Will he?
Two weeks represent too small a sample to get much from. There's also some weirdness mixed in there (Josh Jacobs' fumble at the goal line). I don't think you can pull anything instructive from that.
Likewise, I don't think there's much to read into the half and change Malik Willis played this past Saturday. I chart the offense every week, and they didn't run all that much differently than they have with Jordan Love. Willis scrambled more, but that's not reflective of play design. The most notable thing was they had Love throw almost exclusively out of the gun on the opening possession, but I would imagine that had more to do with what they saw from the Bears on tape than anything else, given those early drives are "scripted."
What area can the Packers exploit the most vs the Ravens?
Even without Micah Parsons and Devonte Wyatt, the Packers should be able to take advantage of the right side of the Ravens' O-line. Daniel Faalele has been one of the weaker starters for any team at his position, and getting quick pressure from the interior will matter whether Lamar Jackson or Tyler Huntley starts on Saturday.
Hey Peter and Jason, thanks for all the hard work covering the team this year!
The feeling around this team since the second half of 2023 (Jordan Love era) has been that they are able to beat anybody but they rarely piece all sides of the ball together and make costly mistakes that waste some of the potential. That being said, we're (one of ) the youngest rosters in the league. Do you think it's still just growing pains? Or is it too late in the process for that?
Thanks for the kind words, Quinn!
The Packers are still young on paper, but this isn't an inexperienced team anymore. Most of the key components have multiple playoff runs under their belts now. I don't think you can use age to hand-wave poor performance in the way you could in 2023.
That said, your description also fits the majority of the league's playoff teams. They might not be as young, but these sorts of inconsistencies aren't just a Green Bay thing. The Rams hit a speed bump early in the season (remember the Jordan Davis TD return on a blocked field goal?) and then blew a two-possession lead this past week. The Eagles have two multi-game losing streaks on their record. And so forth.
I think fans can get a little myopic with this stuff. They will take note of every mistake their favorite team commits but not ding other teams in the same way for their errors. It's just kind of how it goes.
All to say, I don't think the Packers are battling through growing pains, at least not in a manner that's different from other teams. I think their biggest problem is they aren't healthy on either side of the ball, and Micah Parsons isn't available to close games.
100% agree, I have so many friends and family who complain about the Packers and how they look or don't look, and its just because we watch every single snap, we see every take on social media. However, other teams also have their collapses, their issues etc. No team is perfect except for 1. It's difficult to win by wide margins in the NFL and its difficult to keep up that pace.
If the QBs were to switch teams healthy, Lamar in GB, Love in Balti, what team would win? And would both teams be able to represent their "new team" in the super bowl?